Forum Discussion
byo_boy
2 years agoMember
Intro + Neoadjuvant or Adjuvant Chemo?
Hi all,
My wife's just been diagnosed with Invasive Ductal Carcinoma NST (Grade 2-3) ER+, PR+, HER2- with a 29mm tumour and at least 1 involved lymph node. Needless to say it's hit us like a bus and we're in that dark, foggy place pre-treatment where we have no idea what's coming up next.
That said, things have, luckily, moved pretty quickly since the first GP meeting for the initial pathology referral. In the 9 days since visiting the GP, we've had imaging with a mammogram and ultrasound which indicated suspicious findings, then 2 days later a biopsy, followed a day later by the meeting at the GP to get the bad news. Since then we've had our initial meeting with the surgeon at the RBWH, Dr Wong (who seemed very capable, but if anyone else has had him as their surgeon I would still love to hear more about your experience) and some of the MDT. We have our first meeting with Medical Oncology next Friday and the 2 week follow up with the MDT the following week.
During the initial discussion our doctor classified this as "Early Stage" cancer (something we're hanging hope on) and said that we would have a number of options for treatment. My wife's family has quite an extensive history of cancer (mostly breast, with some throat / ovarian), however her Mum was genetically tested years ago and is apparently BRCA negative. When asked what we would prefer as a treatment, we just said we'd rather have a double mastectomy to reduce any chances of recurrence later, however when Dr Wong came in, he had a good chat with us and asked if we were making decisions from an emotional place rather than a practical place. His suggestion is to pursue a neoadjuvent treatment course, followed by genetic testing and then surgery, which if the chemo was effective would possibly mean just a lumpectomy rather than a mastectomy as well as potentially saving some lymph nodes.
Unfortunately we're very sleep deprived and still in a bit of shock so we're not sure what to do. Basically we see it one of two ways:
1. Do the chemo, hope that it shrinks everything (or God-willing completely disappears it) while killing anything else that might be floating around, then do the surgery, then radiation if required.
2. Go the surgery, remove everything including lymph nodes, then hit hard with chemo and radiation if needed to try and smash anything that's left.
Honestly, I get the idea of "patient-centered" treatment where your opinions and wishes are taken into account, but I know if I had a client approach me as the subject matter expert for a highly technical quote on something they didn't know anything about and I asked them to tell me what they thought would be the best option, I wouldn't have a job. This sounds so dumb, but I just want to say something like "wait a second, why are you asking us what treatment should be? Aren't you the expert???" We want to be very positive and forward leaning with this journey and I feel like we have to have an element of trust in the MDT and the process, but could do with some perspective.
Sorry for the wall of text, I blame the lack of sleep!
George
30 Replies
- June1952MemberHi @byo_boy. Hoping Rebecca and you are feeling somewhat less stressed now that the PET scan is over. Sleep well tonight.
- AlfieMemberAll the best today. My thoughts will be with you both.
- byo_boyMemberWell. Heading to bed now to try to get a good night's sleep before our PET scan appointment tomorrow.I just wanted to take a moment to thank you all for being so kind to us. Please keep Rebecca in your thoughts and prayers tomorrow for a clear scan and, God willing, I'll be back with some positive news soon.Take care,George
- cactuskMemberHello there,
The initial whirlwind is hard, especially (for me) the uncertainty and waiting in between appointments. Similar to what has been said above, my rad onc, med onc and surgeon had different ideas for the best path of treatment initially, which not only scared me, but made me think 'hang on, if you guys don't know what's next'. In hindsight I now see that this meant my situation was duly considered before they agreed on the best path forward for me.
I whole heartedly support the exercise focus too. I tried really hard to see an exercise physiologist who specialised in oncology post surgery pre radiation, but had to wait until some time after the procedure (which again, more waiting). I'm back into it now (surgery in December 2023, rads finished February this year, drugs started March2024). There are however, even now, days when a walk around the block is a major achievement.
Absolute best wishes to you and your wife -here's to some skipping along the way.
K - byo_boyMemberHi @AllyJay - thank you for your kind message and for sharing your story ... it really helps to put things in perspective. The fact that you're NED now after your experience is so encouraging and I think you're right, we really just need to trust the team, especially once they have all the facts, and perservere from there.
We've also literally just received our appointment for Rebecca's first PET scan tomorrow (God willing it's all clear), so things are starting to happen now. I had my first decent night's sleep last night in weeks (partly due to a massive walk yesterday and partly due to some phenergan!), which has helped a bit - although now that I'm sleeping deeply enough to have dreams, they're pretty yucky ones, so in a way I think sleeping lightly with minimal dreaming is actually a bit of a blessing :lol:
That said, I ordered the book Life Is Tough (But So Are You) to help keep us in a positive mindset - we're 100% sure we're going to kick this thing's butt together and in an odd way, I'm grateful that this journey has given us a reset and allowed us to really focus on what matters. Once we're done with this phase, I can really see a change where we become people who want to give back rather than just focussing on ourselves. - AllyJayMemberHi there @byo_boy...I'm so sorry both your wife and your supportive self have gained admission tickets to our not-so sought after group. My story is this. I was aged 57 in 2016 and was diagnosed with Stage 3, Grade 3, Triple Positive, Multifocal (more than one little sod) in the left breast, at least 1 axillary node positive and so called 'abnormal geography' in the right breast. I was told I'd have neoadjuvant chemo, followed by surgery. I was not a candidate for radiotherapy due to a different medical condition. To be honest, being a public patient, I was rather sceptical about the sequence. I thought that their surgery lists were waaay too long, and so they were going to do the chemo to keep me in a holding pattern, as it were, until they'd do the surgery. My first instinct was give me a weedwhacker and I'll do the job myself. Eventually sanity (well my hubby would question that) prevailed and I got on with it. The pathology for the removed left breast and full node clearance showed no active cancer cells, only the 'empty tumour beds'. The removed (at my request) right breast showed numerous areas of abnormal cells with a dark history of going bad...so I felt good that I'd pushed for both and got rid of it before it too went feral on me. So for me, I trusted my team...after all this is their bread and butter in their chosen medical speciality...and my result was good...in fact excellent. I still remain NED (no evidence of disease) and just keep on keeping on. My very best wishes to you both and hope that all goes well with treatment. Best wishes...Ally.
- byo_boyMemberHi @Blossom1961 - thank you for your message. This is the hope we have that should we go down that path we'll have a similar experience. A close friend had a very similar journey to us in NZ and she would practically skip in to her next treatment knowing that her tumour was physically shrinking in front of her.She wrote a really good blog post which I'll share here for anyone who's interested:
- Blossom1961Member@byo_boy I had neoadjuvant chemo and found it to be quite positive. Two treatments in and the Onco could not find the lumps and asked me if she had the correct side! By the time I got to surgery (mastectomy) the biopsy they did on the tissue showed the chemo had completely killed off the cancer cells so I knew it had worked. The only reason they ended up doing the mx was because there had been a complete haze of cancer across the whole top of one breast plus the other three spots. I just did what my surgeon recommended. All the best with your decisions.
- arpieMemberRe the $40 a day parking charge - next time you are there, ask at the front reception desk about concessions being available for ongoing cancer 'outpatient clinic' visits ....
I know that when I was visiting daily at a major Sydney Hospital with my husband for cancer treatment, they printed out a voucher that allowed me to come & go without the massive fees ...
Check out this link below as it mentions a couple of concessions ..... but definitely ask at the desk too, as they'd be very aware of any concessions available to you.
https://metronorth.health.qld.gov.au/rbwh/patients-and-visitors/parking-and-transport
Excellent re the walk around the dam .... you have some lovely areas like that up there!! Exercise is good for the soul as well as the body! (Tho it is raining AGAIN down here as I type! grr)
All going well, you'll be able to go to Japan next year!! Your medical team will do their best to make sure you get there!! Keep your eyes on that end goal!! I treated myself to a week at Norfolk Island after I'd finished my active treatment! ;)
Are you your wife's 'official carer'? If not, look into it, as it may reduce costs further for you in other areas, too. Generally, a 'referral' from your GP will kickstart the process. In NSW, an official carer gets free vehicle registration too .... and it may enable you to access the concessional parking 'easier' too (which may range from free parking to a lower priced concession than the $40!)
take care - byo_boyMemberHi @arpie,Thanks for the message, we're at Narangba, North of Brisbane so the drive to the RBWH from here isn't too bad, probably 45 minutes on average, it's the parking that's the real wallet emptier so far at $40 odd a day 😕That's really helpful news about the ongoing consults over the next few years. It's great to get a real sense of what the new "normal" is going to look like for us.We actually have had a holiday to Japan in late March / April 25 basically booked and mostly paid for for months now and of course we're devastated that, depending on treatment etc, we may not be able to make the trip. That said our doctor worked out a really rough schedule and she said "don't cancel anything yet", so we're hoping that we can crush through the treatment and come out the other side ready to have that reward of an amazing holiday.We've actually just come back home from a lovely day out with the kids, we did a really energetic 9KM bush walk around the Ewan Maddock dam up on the Sunshine Coast. It was pretty hard going at spots but was lovely to be out in the fresh air. I'm convinced that, along with a great diet and positive attitude, exercise will play a key part in us having a better outcome. Rebecca is going to speak to her GP tomorrow about getting a management plan in place with a referral to a local Exercise Physiologist who can start to work with Rebecca on an exercise plan before, during and after treatment.